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Mobile GPS on Sprint
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arpruss
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Joined: 11 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a post by Sam Altman on Sprint's developer site: "Here's the caveat: the default PDE address is blank. It's just not there. Write a test program and check it out. Without that, you can't get a fix. It would seem that you could get an unassisted fix without any help from a PDE, but somehow they've blocked that out. Theoretically, and so I've heard from a few other people, if you put the right PDE IP addr and port in, it will work. I finally tracked one down and will test it when I return late next week."

That was in 2005. No news since.

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arpruss
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And other post says that there are costs for doing GPS fixes, and these need to be discussed with Sprint by the developer. And only Sprint partners are allowed to use location services. It sounds like they've decided to lock things by locking the access to the PDE server.
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Cristian Streng
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 5:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

goesh wrote:
Cristian Streng wrote:
I have another alpha version available at http://wap.mgmaps.com/alpha3.html. I hope you'll be able to at least start this one. Anyway, can you try GpsTester first? - http://www.shaftek.org/projects.shtml in the New Download section

Cristian

This version does launch, but I get no location data.
DEBUG: An exception has occured! Exception class java.lang.illegalArgumentException, message: Invalid number of fixes,


This sounds much better, I requested a maximum number of 9999999 GPS fixes which seems to be a bit too much... let's try with 65000 - I've modified the version at http://wap.mgmaps.com/alpha3.html, let me know if there's any change now.

Cristian
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Cristian Streng
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

arpruss wrote:
And other post says that there are costs for doing GPS fixes, and these need to be discussed with Sprint by the developer. And only Sprint partners are allowed to use location services. It sounds like they've decided to lock things by locking the access to the PDE server.

If this is true there's no chance in making MGMaps work Sad... But let's not assume the worst.
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goesh
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 5:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Still no location data, however, the only error now appearing in debug is a gps timeout...Thanks buddy
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arpruss
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the only hope is either to obtain the IP address of Sprint's server, but accessing Sprint's server without Sprint's permission is probably a legal and moral problem, or else to reverse-engineer (hard without violating an EULA, but maybe it could be done in a place where the EULA is not binding) how the server works and make one's own.

I notice that Trimble Outdoors Silver (http://www.trimbleoutdoors.com/Products.aspx) costs only a one-time $20 fee, so it doesn't seem that Sprint necessarily charges a per-use fee for use of their server.

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Cristian Streng
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We'll see about this... I'm still not convinced that I need to put in the server IP in the application, maybe we can find a workaround. There's an earlier post in this topic - http://forum.mgmaps.com/viewtopic.php?p=270#270 - that guy says he was able to install GpsTester AND get valid coordinates.

There are also some (more complicated) instructions to unlock the program at the beginning of this thread, they direct to this page. I think whoever tests MGMaps should first try to install and use GpsTester to get valid coords, then move on to MGMaps.
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Cristian Streng
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cristian Streng wrote:
We'll see about this... I'm still not convinced that I need to put in the server IP in the application, maybe we can find a workaround. There's an earlier post in this topic - http://forum.mgmaps.com/viewtopic.php?p=270#270 - that guy says he was able to install GpsTester AND get valid coordinates.

There are also some (more complicated) instructions to unlock the program at the beginning of this thread, they direct to this page. I think whoever tests MGMaps should first try to install and use GpsTester to get valid coords, then move on to MGMaps.

Oh, and another thing... maybe you need to wait a bit longer to get the first coordinates. Try to start MGMaps, start the GPS code (have GPS Device configured to Internal) then leave the app running for 10-15 minutes - maybe it helps. Same with GpsTester.
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arpruss
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The user who got it working was using an A900. Maybe it's got a different chipset?

Maybe the following trick would work: First run an approved GPS app, like Trimble Silver, in order to get the phone to download the data from the server, and then run mgmaps? (The data is supposed to be valid for an hour before a re-download is needed, and I don't know if it persists between apps.) But I don't want to have to buy an approved GPS app to try this out.

It occurs to me that there could conceivably be problems with editing __policy.txt vis-a-vis the big bad DMCA. On the other hand, maybe something that can be edited by changing a plain-text file doesn't count as an effective access restriction? And Sprint says (http://developer.sprint.com/getDocument.do?docId=85911) that the point of their access restrictions is to protect customer security, so this seems just like changing Internet Explorer security settings. But who knows; I am not a lawyer.

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goesh
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cristian Streng wrote:
Cristian Streng wrote:
We'll see about this... I'm still not convinced that I need to put in the server IP in the application, maybe we can find a workaround. There's an earlier post in this topic - http://forum.mgmaps.com/viewtopic.php?p=270#270 - that guy says he was able to install GpsTester AND get valid coordinates.

There are also some (more complicated) instructions to unlock the program at the beginning of this thread, they direct to this page. I think whoever tests MGMaps should first try to install and use GpsTester to get valid coords, then move on to MGMaps.

Oh, and another thing... maybe you need to wait a bit longer to get the first coordinates. Try to start MGMaps, start the GPS code (have GPS Device configured to Internal) then leave the app running for 10-15 minutes - maybe it helps. Same with GpsTester.



I have followed the instructions for editing the index files on the phone, I got nothing working doing it that way, in fact, Iwouldnt even get a GPS timeout error. arpruss' instructions about editing the _policy.txt file seems to be the most promising, for the A920 I have anyhow. As arpruss aluded, it did update the index files acordingly.

Also, just as an FYI, about a month ago I installed AllSportGPS for location data, this program does successfully access the GPS data. The only downside is that it does cost $6.99/month. However, the GPS data is very accurate and works very well. I took arpruss' suggestion about getting a fix from the paid program then quickly switching over to either GpsTester.jar or MGMaps, same result, GPS Timeout.
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Cristian Streng
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

goesh wrote:
I have followed the instructions for editing the index files on the phone, I got nothing working doing it that way, in fact, Iwouldnt even get a GPS timeout error. arpruss' instructions about editing the _policy.txt file seems to be the most promising, for the A920 I have anyhow. As arpruss aluded, it did update the index files acordingly.

Also, just as an FYI, about a month ago I installed AllSportGPS for location data, this program does successfully access the GPS data. The only downside is that it does cost $6.99/month. However, the GPS data is very accurate and works very well. I took arpruss' suggestion about getting a fix from the paid program then quickly switching over to either GpsTester.jar or MGMaps, same result, GPS Timeout.

I see... well, if you're willing to share the AllSportGPS application with me and if you have access to its jad/jar files, send me a PM and I'll have a look over it. I can try to reverse engineer it and see how it uses the GPS. You may be breaking the licensing terms for that application by sending it to me, so feel free to ignore this message if you wish. Smile

Cristian
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arpruss
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I tried a modified GpsTester set to connect to an ip address and port number on my server. I then listened for a connection on my server with nc -v, but nothing happened. That may just be because I don't have vision (but vision doesn't seem to be required for GPS).
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Cristian Streng
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

arpruss wrote:
I tried a modified GpsTester set to connect to an ip address and port number on my server. I then listened for a connection on my server with nc -v, but nothing happened. That may just be because I don't have vision (but vision doesn't seem to be required for GPS).

Did you try TCP? Maybe it uses UDP instead... or maybe it uses TCP but the Sprint server filters the packets (if that is the case, set GpsTester to connect to TCP port 80 on your server, it will just be a bit more difficult to filter the GpsTester connection from regular web traffic).
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arpruss
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cristian Streng wrote:
arpruss wrote:
I tried a modified GpsTester set to connect to an ip address and port number on my server. I then listened for a connection on my server with nc -v, but nothing happened. That may just be because I don't have vision (but vision doesn't seem to be required for GPS).

Did you try TCP? Maybe it uses UDP instead... or maybe it uses TCP but the Sprint server filters the packets (if that is the case, set GpsTester to connect to TCP port 80 on your server, it will just be a bit more difficult to filter the GpsTester connection from regular web traffic).


It was set to TCP (you can select). I may try port 80 later.

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arpruss
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cristian Streng wrote:
We'll see about this... I'm still not convinced that I need to put in the server IP in the application, maybe we can find a workaround. There's an earlier post in this topic - http://forum.mgmaps.com/viewtopic.php?p=270#270 - that guy says he was able to install GpsTester AND get valid coordinates.


Looking at Sprint dev forums, it looks like in mid January Sprint made some changes that restricted access to location data, and thereby they locked out GpsTester. What's interesting is that that post was made several months after that. But maybe that poster was describing something done before mid-January... Can you contact that poster to see if GpsTester is STILL working?

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errr0r
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arpruss, talk to me on AIM. We will work on this together.

AIM: pc2pctransfer

Time: sometime tonight 9pm-ish EST.
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arpruss
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

errr0r wrote:
Arpruss, talk to me on AIM. We will work on this together.

AIM: pc2pctransfer

Time: sometime tonight 9pm-ish EST.


I don't do IM. Sad

Email me: arpruss at gmail dot com.

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errr0r
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Email sent. Wink

but I think we would benefit better from a real-time messaging protocol. IRC, Gtalk, or something.
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arpruss
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2006 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interestingly, the PDE protocol looks like it's fully documented:
http://www.3gpp2.org/Public_html/specs/C.S0022-0_v3.0_121203.pdf

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Cristian Streng
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

arpruss wrote:
Looking at Sprint dev forums, it looks like in mid January Sprint made some changes that restricted access to location data, and thereby they locked out GpsTester. What's interesting is that that post was made several months after that. But maybe that poster was describing something done before mid-January... Can you contact that poster to see if GpsTester is STILL working?

I did contact the poster, and GpsTester is still working for him! He used QPST to enable GPS access in the program... you probably know what that means more than I do Wink He also said he got a null-pointer exception when trying MGMaps, but then again he may have tried the old version that crashed for others too. I've invited him to post another message here.

Cristian
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